Capa controles motorizados

Vinophonics presenta 16 controles motorizados que son sensibles a los datos que recibe desde el blockchain así como los datos generados por una aplicación web disponible para usuarios registrados de MTB. A su vez estos sliders motorizados responden al tacto del operador en vivo que lo esté manipulando.

Datasheet slider motorizado 60mm bourns:

https://www.mouser.es/datasheet/2/54/sm-778343.pdf

Puente H:

L293B

https://www.electrontools.com/Home/WP/2016/03/09/como-funciona-el-puente-h-l293b/

A continuación se describen las posibilidades de implementación y las problemáticas:
Opción 1: Slider motorizado con dos pistas, la pista 2 es necesario para generar el voltaje de referencia tanto para el driver del motor como para mandar un dato de posición a la web.

La pista resistiva 1 es la que se utiliza para atenuar cada canal de control del vinophonics.

El problema que puede presentar esta solución que es que el ruido de motor y de PWM que se use para control afecte a la señal que pasa por la pista afectando notablemente el resultado sonoro de Vinophonics.

Open

Opción 2 (usar amplificadores controlados por voltaje en cada canal):

En esta opción la señal de audio no pasa por el slider motorizado. En su lugar el slider atenua un voltaje que controla los VCA de cada canal. Cada canal de control de voltaje tiene que estar muy filtrado para evitar que los ruidos de los sliders pasen al control del VCA. Cada VCA entonces atenua las señales de cada canal de Vinophonics proporcionando señal libre de interferencia.

Open

@Toni:

El principal problema es que el tema de lo sliders motorizados necesitan de circuitos

drivers para controlar el movimiento y posición y ahí yo no tengo

experiencia ni conocimiento para abordar esa parte..

Lo único que he visto a modo de solución es usar Arduino con puente H pero eso

va a implicar usar un combo de esos componentes para cada slider...

Ahora mismo no tengo una forma más óptima para controlar cada slider.

Necesito alternativas más optimizadas a cada circuito de estos por slider:

14-01-2019: Estudiando opciones de multiplexado para optimizar a más numero de controles por microprocesador.

Actualización 23 Jan 2019  Estudiando opciones basadas en plataforma Teensy

24 Feb 2019   Mike Barrow Recopilación de proyectos sobre motorización de faders:

16 Faders motorizados la mejor opción de proyecto encontrada hasta hoy:

https://forum.pjrc.com/threads/42477-Teensy-3-6-controlled-motorfader-panel

https://forum.pjrc.com/threads/42477-Teensy-3-6-controlled-motorfader-panel/page2

https://forum.pjrc.com/threads/54995-Zeus-Commander-SPS-16-MIDI-step-amp-pattern-sequencer

Estudiando la posibilidad de esta posibilidad junto a Winter Modular (espero respuesta pronto) de modificar el código para:

Necesito que cada slider responda a un MIDI CC determinado en lugar de nota MIDI (según proyecto original)

Integrar conversión MIDI a Voltaje y Voltaje a MIDI e interfaz USB a MIDI in out

Interfaz USB MIDI y pltaforma Teensy:
https://forum.pjrc.com/threads/32384-Teensy-3-1-Midi-USB-Interface-1-in-2-Out-Thru-(split)-Midi-Controller

https://www.pjrc.com/teensy/td_midi.html

http://codeandlife.com/2016/01/17/midi-to-usb-adapter-with-teensy-lc/

http://www.yannseznec.com/works/teensy-usb-midi-controller-code/

12/03/2019 Recopilación de conversaciones sobre el diseño de los sliders motorizados funcionando como atenuadores de señal:

---Quote (Originally by guti002)---
Hi ***,
First of all congratulations for your motorized sequencer project, is really beautiful!

I'm working in a project and need 16 motorized sliders being controlled by MIDI from computer and the same computer receives via MIDI the actual value of the fader if the user modify by hand.
Is a simple mixer, need that every one of the 16 faders responds to MIDI CC for example, CC 30, 31 32... until CC 45

I don't have any experience with teensy platforms. So I need solve the USB-MIDI interface and control the 16 faders and the same interface trasmit to the computer the fader position or the real CC value so the sofware controller can update value register if the user modifiy by hand any fader position.

I will ask you if you can make me a quotation for design this project for me.

Thanks in advance.
Toni.
---End Quote---
Hi Tony,

Thanks for the compliment:)

Although I don't do contract design work I can give you a few hints and help you along.
The first question would be: What is the usage? What is the controller controlling?
The thing is that motorfaders are expensive components (just over €20 a piece) and if your case is not very special is makes much more sense to just get a MIDI controller. It will be difficult to make something like a Presonus faderport 16 for much less. For 16 faders you'd need two panels and a controlling Teensy, a complicated setup just for mixing. Two fader panels and a main controller will do the job but the question is if it's worth the effort.
Another things is that using standard MIDI controller messages (0-127) for mixing might be too low resolution. The Mackie Control Protocol (used for most controllers) uses pitch bend data for the faders with 10 bit (0-1023) resolution and even this is considered just adequate by some.

It's not really possible to give good advice if I don't know what the controller is controlling. In any case, the software part is easy, having the fader react to and send controller values is simple.

Kind regards,


***************

02-27-2019, 09:56 AM

Hi ***02-27-2019, 09:56 AM02-27-2019, 09:56 AM
Thanks for quick and extense reply.
Yes the idea is still in very early stage. This idea is not for commercial use is for one company show / meeting just one unit. A friend have a company and need to have 16 motorized controls. These motorized sliders are controlled from a remote web app, and the company wants that someone in the other side of the planet can control this device and the app can monitorize the real state of the fader position (this is the reason for a feedback comunitacion) 
The faders only attenuates an incoming analog signal, they work like passive resistors at their track 1... the idea is a simple mixer controlled in that way.
Maybe in this motorized control units as I can see have two resistor tracks, one for doing the task and other is used for track position. The track 1 in the controlles maybe send voltage I don't know, my idea is to hack or use this track to manage audio... or hack to attenuate every analog audio channel or use the Voltage as CV lines and design 16 VCA to control de audio mix...

As you can see I don't have experience in this kind of technology or market, so I take a look for already built units.
I can see that there is two Behringer products that can be the basis of this work:
Behringer xtouch compact and the extender. I can see the extender can work standalone. I dont find yet a good user manual about this controller, but I supposse that can be used for this project in some way... thinking that I only really need 16 motorized faders that can be controlled by a MIDI or similar languaje.

Your advice is really good for me, because I dont know the best way for start. So your oppinion will be really really useful for me... you have right when considering using an already built unit, as I see the Behringer price...

Thanks a lot for your time, waiting your oppinion.

PS. If I don't make me understandard right I can write you a diagram picture

Hi Tony,

The faders I used are for control only, they have a single lineair (10k) resistance track. Faders with two tracks, one for servo duty and one for audio, are much more expensive, somewhere around €80 a piece. This type of fader is used in large mixing consoles. My approach uses PWM to control the motors so this would not be suitable for faders with two tracks because the high current PWM power will probably interfere with the audio signal.
It might be easier to just get a remote controllable mixer like the Behringer X32 compact (http://www.musictribe.com/Categories/Behringer/Mixers/Digital/X32-COMPACT/p/P0AAP) or some other mixer by Behringer (http://www.musictribe.com/Categories/Behringer/Mixers/c/123411?colExpFlag=,Mixers) or something from Mackie (https://mackie.com/products/mixers). You will not be able to beat the Behringer prices with DIY.
I don't have any experience with these products so I don't know how good they are and can't give you any recommendations.
How good does the audio quality have to be? Are you aiming for high-end studio quality?

I'm building my own controllers because what I want is not available commercially or there are too many compromises to keep the price low. With the current market it doesn't make sense to try to build a commercially available device for less, you just can't beat the "economy of scale". DIY makes (economic) sense if you have a very specific use case or for stuff that just isn't there.

Kind regards,

**********************

Hi ***
Sorry the delay, too much work here.
I transmit this to the director and said me that doesnt want to use any propietary design like behringer, he wants to publish the schematics as open source when is done and the rip off idea is not valid for him.

The target of the faders are control the amount of different audio or CV signals, the outputs are going to different patch point of a modular synth. So the idea is anyone can control the amount of different modultation sources via remote control and at the same time anyone can see the driving of each amount.

I understand your approach and is ver beatiful, I like the classic step sequencer like the ARP Sequencer so Love your design.

At this moment I don't know how to do with that, the idea is that ... control the amount of different audio or cv signals 

Really appreciate so much your time and attention if you think one solution Im here 

Thanks.
Toni.

Mike Barrow Resumen de las conversacions sobre sliders motorizados